Episode 18 - Angela Dingle

Angela Dingle joins JSL's Vickie Hubbard for Episode 18 of Not Your Average DEI Podcast! Angela and Vickie discuss the intersectionality between businesses and public policy, the future of DEI and supplier inclusion, and Angela's professional journey.

As President and CEO of Women Impacting Public Policy (WIPP), Angela Dingle leads a national nonpartisan organization advocating on behalf of women entrepreneurs, strengthening their impact on our nation’s public policy, creating economic opportunities, and forging alliances with other business organizations. Serving as the voice for the over 14 million women owned companies in the U.S., WIPP works with lawmakers to impact and influence policy that provides economic equity, procurement inclusion and access to the global marketplace.

Prior to serving in this role, Angela founded Ex Nihilo Management, an award-winning technology and management consultancy that provides governance, risk management and cybersecurity (GRC) to the public, private and non-profit sector. Her commitment to client success earned her a reputation as a trusted advisor and strategic partner.

Angela is a sought-after speaker and thought leader, sharing her insights and expertise at conferences and events focused on women in business and government contracting. She is the author of Discovering Your Girl Powers: 10 Strategies to Build Confidence, Charisma and Credibility and Unexpected Leader: 11 Tools for Transformational Leadership. She has written articles and publications that provide valuable leadership guidance.

Angela holds a MS in Management Information Systems from Bowie State University, a BS in Computer Science from DeVry University, a Certified Myers Briggs Type Indicator (MBTI) Practitioner, and a Certified Management Consultant (CMC).  Angela is a member of Delta Sigma Theta Sorority, Inc.

Transcript

Angela Dingle Podcast Transcript 

Vickie: [00:00:00] This episode was prerecorded earlier this year and may reference topics that are still evolving. 

Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of Not Your Average DEI Podcast. I'm Vickie Hubbard, a member of JURISolutions Legal’s Inclusive Engagement Committee, and joining me today is Angela Dingle, President and CEO of Women Impacting Public Policy, also referred to as WIPP. 

I'm so excited to have Angela on our show today. She is just such a dynamic leader. There's so much for her to share in this time, and I'm just ready to just jump right in and get to it. Today we'll be having a fireside chat with Angela. As I shared, she is the President and CEO of WIPP, but she's also a business owner as well. 

During our chat, we'll learn more about WIPP and her thoughts on intersectionality between businesses and public policy, the future of DEI [00:01:00] and supplier diversity, a little bit about Angela's business and Angela's professional journey. But before we delve into today's conversation, I want to share a little bit about Angela's bio. 

In addition to her being the president and CEO of WIPP, she is the owner and founder of X Nihilo Management, an award-winning technology and management consultancy firm that provides governance, risk management and cybersecurity to the public, private, and nonprofit sector. Her commitment to client success earned her a reputation as a trusted advisor and strategic partner. 

She is a sought-after speaker and thought leader, sharing her insights and expertise at conferences and events, and focus on women in business and government contracting. She is the author of Discovering Your Girl Powers: 10 Strategies to Build Confidence, Charisma, and [00:02:00] Credibility, and she's the author of Unexpected Leader: 11 Tools for Transformational Leadership. 

She has written articles and publications that provide valuable leadership guidance. Angela holds an MS in management information systems from Bowie State University, a BS in computer science from DeVry University. She is a certified Meyer Briggs type indicator practitioner and a certified management consultant. 

As president and CEO of Women Impacting Public Policy, Angela leads a national nonpartisan organization advocating on behalf of women entrepreneurs strengthening their impact on our nation's public policy, creating economic opportunities, and forging alliances with other business organizations. 

Everyone, let's all welcome Angela to the show. Hi Angela. 

Angela: Hi, Vickie. It's so good to be with you. Thanks for having me today. 

Vickie: Absolutely. I'm just [00:03:00] so, so excited to jump into this conversation. It's just such a timely opportunity to have you on our show. I know that you're very, very dear friends with JURISolutions Legal’s President and CEO Cindy Towers, and she raves about you all the time. 

She is also a member of Women Impacting Public Policy, and this is just a great platform for you to share a little bit about Women Impacting Public Policy, what it actually does, and you stepped into this role last year, and you've done made such a strong impact transitioning into this role. 

And so this is just such an opportunity for our listeners to learn about Women Impacting Public Policy and for all of those women owned businesses out there that are listening, be it a women-owned law firm, be it any other industry in which you own your own business, or any underrepresented group that are business owners. 

This is a great opportunity to listen to a true [00:04:00] trailblazer and grab some great nuggets from today's discussion. But before we jump into the reason why we're here, let's just warm up our audience and allow them to get to know you a little bit. Angela, are you ready for maybe one or two icebreaker questions? 

Angela: I am ready for the icebreaker questions. 

Vickie: Okay. Okay. So everyone that's listening, I shared her bio. Angela is super dynamic. She wears so many hats and is super experienced. And so with all that you do, Angela, running your own company and leading WIPP trailblazing and impacting change just all over the place, like I'm hoping that you have some time for yourself to really enjoy life. And I'm hoping the answer to that is yes. So, do you have time to breathe and bask in the sun? That's the question. 

Angela: That's a really good question, is one that I, a, I get asked, uh, pretty frequently and before I answer, let me tell you that we absolutely love Cindy. She has been a member of WIPP [00:05:00] for a long time and advocate for women business owners and such a helpful resource when questions come up about legal issues. So, we absolutely love partnering with her. 

I do take some time to take care of myself, so I try really hard to have some hours every morning that belong to me where I'm not really focused on work, because once the workday starts, it happens pretty quickly. 

The second thing I'd have to say is technology is my friend. If it's on my calendar, it's happening, and if it's not, it's not. So that also means the thing that brings me joy, which is laying on a beach or looking at the, looking at a rainbow over the ocean, that too goes on my calendar. So I do. I take some time. I have a couple of little spots in the Caribbean that I sneak off to and take pictures of the sun and watch rainbows, and that makes me happy. 

Vickie: I love that the Caribbean, so I love the Caribbean as well and I, and I travel a lot, but a lot of the places that I've been have been in the Caribbean. I really need to diversify my travel. Okay. What is one or maybe two things that [00:06:00] fill your cup of joy? 

Angela: Anyone who knows me, including the board chair for WIPP, when she introduces me, she says, hi, this is Angela Dingle. She is the CEO of WIPP, and Angela has a baby. Well, I don't technically have a baby. 

My first granddaughter was born two years ago, so in October of ‘22, and that little one just brings me so much joy. She makes me laugh. I can just be having a really tough day, and she's just a funny little girl. 

So, we sing together. She has a little guitar and we listen to these little nursery rhymes. She gives me the drum set and she plays the guitar and we sing and dance like I'm two years old, so that's one of the things that make me happy.  

Vickie: A singing family. I love that. So let's make our transition to the reason why we're here. 

Typically Not Your Average DEI Podcast is a platform in which we invite thought leaders from law firms and corporate legal departments to join our show to have, you know, authentic conversations regarding [00:07:00] diversity, equity, and inclusion in the legal industry. However, our business is also a certified women-owned business. 

We're WeBank certified, and I, as I shared listeners, our CEO and President, Cindy Towers is also a member of WIPP and it is just a great platform for our listeners who may not have an understanding of the strong impact that WIPP has actually made and continues to make as it relates to the benefits of women owned businesses, we have the right person on this platform today to speak to that. 

And so take out your notepad, take out your phone, make some notes in your phone, but this is just going to be a wonderful opportunity for you all to learn. If you did know, now you will know about Women Impacting Public Policy. So Angela, can you tell us more about WIPP and how it supports women on businesses? 

Angela: Great question. So, Women Impacting Public Policy has been [00:08:00] around for, we will be 25 years old this time next year since our inception in June of 2001. WIPP has been advocating for and educating women business owners on how to strengthen their impact on the nation's public policy. We also work to create economic opportunities for women business owners, and we've helped to forge alliances. 

We do it and we teach other women business owners how to forge alliances with other business organizations that can help them to achieve the goals that they want to in their business. The way that that looks is we review upcoming public policy, we provide input to policy makers and other organizations that are looking at policies that might affect their constituents. 

We help our members to identify specific positions, and we take specific positions on economic issues and on policies that affect the bottom line of our members. That's the work that we're doing.  

Vickie: It's necessary work. It [00:09:00] doesn't just impact women-owned businesses in a positive way, but it also indirectly impacts minority-owned businesses, right? 

Angela: It does. We've got a variety of different business owners, right? So they might be diverse women-owned businesses, they might be small, they might be large across a variety of different industries as well.  

Vickie: So for those individuals that are listening today that may be saying to themselves, well, I don't own my own business. 

I'm not a women-owned business owner, but I do own my own business as a minority. What is in it for me in today's discussion? Why should I continue listening to today's episode? What would you want to say to them to keep them engaged today?  

Angela: The thing that business owners need to understand is, and this is the onus behind our conversation, right, is this intersectionality between public policy and business. 

If you're not engaged in those conversations, somebody else is making decisions on behalf of your business. They're making decisions that impact you every single [00:10:00] day. So you have a choice. You can join an organization like WIPP or another organization who is an advocate on your behalf, as long as there's an alignment between the priorities that you have for your business and what that organization supports. 

Vicki mentioned that I'm a business owner. When I started my business, I started my business for a number of different reasons. None of them was public policy. However, I quickly ran into roadblocks or issues that I didn't understand, and I was like led by a higher power to WIPP. 

One of my colleagues at the time was the chairman of the board. She invited me to a WIPP event. I could not believe when I walked in the room, and I'm a pretty smart woman. I couldn't believe that these people were having conversations about the very things that were impacting my business. And that I had an opportunity to speak directly to policy makers about whether or not I like those decisions. 

So, it was mind blowing for me and for any business owner who wants to [00:11:00] grow, wants to scale, wants to change the world, you need to be paying attention to regulatory and policy decisions that can affect your ability to do that.  

Vickie: I love that. So let, let's live there for a moment. What are some of the most effective strategies that you have identified that disenfranchised businesses can use to engage with policymakers and advocate for their interests? 

Angela: Again, I kind of mentioned getting involved in organizations like this, right? So I attended that initial event where I learned about WIPP’s policy parties. So these are the five, six, at the time there were eight of them, things that are important to and impact a woman's ability to be successful in business. 

And what that taught me as a business owner is I was not alone. Right? Sometimes the things that we are experiencing as business owners make us feel like we're on an island by ourselves, and we don't necessarily know the answers. The answers are out there or a path to the answers are there. And [00:12:00] so anyone who is facing any kind of issues or is a disenfranchised business owner needs to be looking for those solutions in a way that doesn't tax just themselves, right? 

So I attended that first one and helped me understand, well, this very issue that I'm running into from a business standpoint, there are other business owners that are having that problem as well. And so not only can my voice be heard, but my voice can be joined with all of these other women business owners. 

There are 14 million women businesses in the United States today. And what would it sound like to a policymaker if Angela walked up and said, Hey. I need access to capital. They might just ignore me. But if I bring the voice of 14 million women business owners to a policymaker and say, Hey, we need access to capital, we're going to get a different type of response. 

So, what someone said to me at the time was either get into public policy or get out business, and I actually believed them. It's been a game changer for me. I've had the opportunity, and you can too, have the opportunity to testify [00:13:00] directly in front of Congress about the things that impact your business. 

We do cybersecurity. I've spoken to Congress on more than one occasion directly in the room with them about whether or not I agree on federal policies related to cybersecurity. You can't get better than that, the investment that you make in an organization , in membership dues or whatever that financial contribution may be is worth you having that direct conversation. 

I've been to the White House to talk about cybersecurity. I've been invited to sit on panels to talk about executive orders that have to do with cybersecurity. It's been a game changer, and so I think that's something that your listeners ought to be thinking about. The other is, once you get engaged with an organization like WIPP, for instance. 

In order for us to come up with those public policy priorities, we don't just make them up, we're talking to the business owners. So, each year we use a variety of different data points to assist us in formulating the policy priorities that we're gonna focus on. So we currently have a member survey that's [00:14:00] out, so our members get to tell us specifically, this is what I like. 

This is not what I like. This is how it impacts me. Here's the type of company that I am, and this is why this is important. Here's what I think about taxes and not right. We take all of that information, we analyze that information so that we can have focused and meaningful conversations with policymakers on Capitol Hill, as well as with our strategic partners. 

Now, what that also does is allow us to make recommendations 'cause we not only hear what the issues are, now we know what recommendations we wanna make. So we don't just go to Congress and say, Hey, women need access to capital. We go to Congress and say, women need access to capital and here are two or three or six recommendations on how you can do that. 

You might change lending guidelines. You might make more funding available to a community development fund. You might release grants that might be able to assist women business owners. You get to have an active voice. You get to formulate policies, you get to formulate recommendations on what it is that's going to be meaningful for you, and that [00:15:00] may look different for every business owner, but I guarantee you, I've had it happen to me twice since I started my business. 

The first time with that WIPP, when I was telling you about another was a WeBank event. So WeBank Women's Business Enterprise National Council, certifying body in the private sector attended a WeBank event that was specifically designed for businesses that are owned for women of color. When I agreed to join the discussion, it was because I was a woman of color and had run into some issues. 

I had no idea whatsoever that there were, there were two or some odd women in the room with me and they were having the very same issue, right? It changes your perspective. It allows you to think outside of the box. I left that event and I started a women's CEO network. That's how meaningful it was for me. 

Vickie: Listeners, I told you she has so much information to share. Look, Angela, this is an opportunity. You dropped a whole lot of good stuff right there. If our business owners that are listening that are like, it all sounds great, but I just don't know where to start. Like, can I just call you Angela and ask you for help?[00:16:00]  

Don't do that listeners. We don't want that. But where would you direct those business owners that are like, I like what she's sharing, and I would like to learn more. I need someone to advise me on next steps or action steps. Who would you recommend?  

Angela: Well, obviously I'd recommend WIPP, right? You can go check us out at WIPP.org. 

There are also professional associations like WIPP has what we call coalition partners. These are organizations that have policies or initiatives that align with our mission. We help them to be a voice for their members, and they help us to understand that we're hearing those voices and formulating our policies appropriately. 

Sos you might think about professional associations. You might do something like get your WeBank certification, right? Once you have your WeBank certification, we are their advocacy partner, so you get to hear from and work alongside with WIPP as a result of having your WeBank certification. You could also, if it is a federal [00:17:00] policy, federal policies typically have comment periods. 

So if you look in the federal registry before new laws are passed, they're put out for the public to be able to see them. And there may be a comment period, and if it's a comment period, that's your opportunity to add your voice. Now, as a member of WIPP, we do that for you, right? We will put that message out to our members and say, Hey, there's a open comment period. We've got policy recommendations that have already been formulated. 

If it requires a response on behalf of an organization, WIPP will respond, if it requires a response on behalf of individuals, we teach people how to advocate, so we're gonna give our members a template to say, Hey, talk to your congressperson about this, or go and respond to this particular initiative that's been put out on the federal registry. Those are all the kinds of ways that you can add your voice and you can go meet with your Congress people. You just need to be mindful about how you, how you do that, right? Every person who's one of their constituents wants to meet with them on a regular basis. 

If you're going to do that, you need to do that in a [00:18:00] way that is informed and has an intended outcome as opposed to just grievances is probably the best way I can say that.  

Vickie: Understood. Love it. Love it. So, I want you to really speak even more to how WIPP can help our listeners regarding regulatory challenges that they may be facing. How can WIPP a system in that way? 

Angela: We provide services based on our core principles, and our three core principles are what we call ACE: Advocacy, Community, and Education. So from an advocacy standpoint, every month our members get to hear from our advocacy team who's on the hill on a regular basis, right? 

So me and them are doing a whole lot of texting right about now because there's so much that that's happening on the hill. But our members get to hear directly from them. So they're gonna give an update on all that is happening on Capitol Hill, whether that is elections or hearings, like the confirmation hearings are going on [00:19:00] right now. 

The executive orders are happening right now. Our members get to hear an update from them firsthand on that, and they get an opportunity to ask questions about that. So just before we started our podcast, I had a voicemail where someone was saying, Hey, there's this new executive order on DEI. Can you tell me how that affects me? 

So while Angela may not answer that question directly, our team does that for our entire membership, so we do an advocacy update on a regular basis. We have what are called instant impact meetings. This is where wherever you are in the country, you get to meet with other business owners, and we have a conversation about issues that matter, right? 

The current administration has an interest in artificial intelligence. An interest in manufacturing, in engineering. This administration has an interest, may not be perceived as a positive one currently, in DEI. Right? You get to meet with other business owners, subject matter experts, and our partners to have conversations about that. 

What does that look like for your [00:20:00] business? If you are a minority business and you're not taking advantage of artificial intelligence, currently you're a business owner and you're not taking advantage of artificial intelligence, you might be doing yourself a disservice. We provide our business owners the opportunity to learn what's happening in that technology space and ways that they can either use it to their advantage or how it might hurt them if there's a regulation that's happening, right? 

And the other thing that we have from an advocacy standpoint. Two others that I'll talk about. One is we, those policy parties that I talked to you about, we published something called an economic blueprint. That's the discussion that I walked into 20, 15, 20 some odd years ago, was a discussion of the economic blueprint at the time that essentially said this, this, this, and this are issues. 

Here are our recommendations, and oh, by the way, Congress, we wanna meet with you and presidential candidates and elected officials. We wanna meet with you to talk to you about them. So our economic blueprint is published on our website. It lays out those policies and recommendations, and it's a useful tool [00:21:00] for the ecosystem as a whole to understand what's going on. 

It allows us to have conversations with partners. It allows us to find organizations that help to support our mission. It allows us to have a platform to speak at conferences. The other call that I got today was to speak at a conference about those types of issues. And then the final piece, it's not the only one, but the final one I'll talk about today from an advocacy standpoint is something called a legislative fly in. 

This is an opportunity for our members to come to Washington DC. We go meet with the Senate, we go meet with the house. We meet with the White House, we meet with the different administration components, and our members get an opportunity to have firsthand conversations with them about the issues. You sit in the room, you raise your hand, you get your question answered from the people that have the answers right then and there. 

So we do hill visits, take lots of pictures, eat fun food, and come back and get back to the work of advocating. The second piece is community. Community is the combination of a number of things. It's our members. It's our corporate partner, so they're corporations that [00:22:00] support our mission. It is our, what we call coalition partners. 

These are other organizations who have alignment either in their policies or in their mission that can support us. Those organizations help us to gather voices and make sure that we're representing the voice of women business owners across the country. From a community standpoint, we have educational programs that teaches you how to do business with the federal government. 

For over 10 years, we've run an educational program called Challenge Her. It is a collaboration between WIPP, American Express, and the Small Business Administration. It is free to the public. We do 12 events a year. Four of them are in person, a full day of education, free of charge, where you get access to contracting officers, small business directors, buyers, like-minded business owners, decision makers come and spend the day with us to teach people how to do business with the federal government. 

We also do eight virtual programs under Challenge Her. We have something called Pro [00:23:00] Table Talk and you know, table talks are all the rage, right? So, we're talking the subject matters experts about the things that business owners need to know in order to be successful. 

We've got a program called Matchmaker Madness where you get an opportunity to meet one-on-one with federal buyers and buyers in the private sector. We do that twice a year. We've got an annual conference. So, lots of ways for people to get together as a community and meet like-minded business owners. 

And we encourage people to do business with one another. I mean, I absolutely love Cindy. 'cause Cindy shows up. If WIPP has a booth on a conference floor, we know that Cindy's gonna come by and see us and we do the same thing. We go looking for her. Because that connection between the two of us is really important. 

We wanna be supportive to her business, and we want her to be supportive to the things that WIPP is doing. And then that final piece is education. WIPP has an education institute, so that's our charitable nonprofit. We have something called a Procurement Center of Excellence. So we're teaching people about capital [00:24:00] readiness. 

Because I can run a business, but I don't have any capital. If I've got all the passion and not the money to run the business, that's gonna hurt me. So what do I need to do as a business owner? What do I need to understand about how lending is done? What are the sources that are available to me? 

How might I get access to them? Do I understand my financials? And how am I going to present those? We also have something called a Procurement Readiness Executive Leadership Program. So currently we've been doing that live this year, starting in March. We'll do that virtually. So, it will be self-paced and online for people to take classes to understand how do I like, I think I'm ready, how do I do business with the federal government? 

We also offer that education in partnership with WeBank. We typically have some government education that's available at their annual conference every year, so make sure you stop by to see us. We'll also do this year a, what we're calling master classes. 

So if you're a seasoned business owner and you know how to, you know, go get that worked, and we'll tell you how to be strategic about doing that in the [00:25:00] federal marketplace. So, advocacy, community and education.  

Vickie: How can individuals listening, I mean, this is where you wanna be connected. You wanna be connected to WIPP. 

If you are a woman-owned business or a women-owned business, WIPP is who you really wanna be connected to? What is the process for that to become a member, Angela?  

Angela: To become a member, all you have to do is if you see us in person, you stop by our booth. We typically have a QR code that you can scan, you can pay for your membership right then. 

If you would like to go and find out more about our member benefits, you just go to WIPP.org. You'll see the menu option for community, and you'll just click the option that says, join WIPP. Put your credit card payment in there. You'll get a message from our membership director. She'll reach out to you and tell you how to get connected. We do orientation every month. 

We encourage our new members to take advantage of that because if you join the community and you don't really know how to [00:26:00] get engaged, you'll look up a year from now and go, Hmm, was that really worth it? And we want it to be worth every dime of your money. And then once you do orientation, you learn how to get connected with us. 

So there are lots of opportunities for you to engage online and see us out in the community, in person.  

Vickie: Excellent. Okay, so Angela, let's transition now to inclusion in the workforce and supplier inclusion, which of course are two different things in addition to safeguarding a company's inclusion and supplier inclusion programs so they stay within legal boundaries. 

How do we encourage corporations to keep moving forward? Especially now when we're seeing that some Fortune 500 corporations continue to roll back these initiatives? What more can be done to sustain progress in both areas?  

Angela: You make some really good points there, and as individuals, I'm not certain that an individual is gonna convince unless you've got some product or service that they just can't survive without. 

I don't know that that individual [00:27:00] voice is going to mean anything. I will tell you though, that the organizations that you belong to, whether that be WIPP or WeBank or anyone else, those organizations have a voice, right? And they can communicate the importance of that. The data though, is what's really important. 

If you think about a multinational firm, so a firm who has business here in the United States, as well as somewhere else in the world, in particular, places like Europe. What we do here in the United States and what we say about DEI here in the United States is not the reality. Once you get outside of the contiguous US. 

Because those countries have made sustainability and DEI as its form, as it is discussed here in the United States, is a component of sustainability. Sustainability is good for business. The data has shown that companies, corporations who have diverse workforces and diverse supply chains, it's good for business in that [00:28:00] it helps to improve the performance of the business. 

It helps to improve their ability to acquire talent. It helps to increase innovation and creativity, and I'm talking percentages in the range of 40% easier to acquire talent if you have a diversity initiative and or diverse supply chain. 57% increase in the amount of innovation and competitiveness that a company can see when they have a diverse supply chain or diverse workforce, right? 

It just makes good business sense. And last year, business leaders were willing to say that during the current climate, I'm not certain how comfortable they would be saying that there's a lot of things that are happening right now in the country that may make it difficult for business owners to want to say that they focused on those initiatives in particular as we see the new administration get settled in and change some of the ways that we've done business in the past, you may see more and more corporations that are reluctant to [00:29:00] say that openly. 

The reality, those stakeholders want benefits. If they are investing their time or their talents or their money, they wanna see a return on that and you get a good return on your investment when you have a diverse supply chain and diverse workforce. 

So, two different things, right? I'll talk now about supply chain. I grew up working for the federal government. When I started my company, we started doing business with the federal government. And I will tell you that you hear policymakers say it all the time. Small businesses are the engine of the US economy. 

That's because large corporations, and I'll talk first to the federal marketplace, large corporations, they outsource that business. Small businesses are a lot more agile and nimble than large businesses are. Large businesses have internal processes. That means that it takes a little bit more time for them to be able to make decisions and turn a big mammoth ship around, where small businesses tend to be thrifty and agile and flexible [00:30:00] with respect to the way that they deliver services. 

If we eliminate the ability for small businesses and diverse businesses to operate in those spaces, we'll start to see business slow down, we'll see less productivity, we'll see less innovation. I've worked for a billion dollar corporations. I've worked for the tiniest ones. I've worked for them all before I started my own. 

And I can tell you that the amount of time that it takes to do something in a large corporation versus the amount of time that it might take you to get it done in a small business is night and day. 

So we know for a fact that there are important reasons to have supply chain initiatives because how am I going to, if we remove DEI and we remove diversity from the discussion, how am I going to acquire that talent and or those products and services that I need to be able to deliver to my customers? 

The other thing is, and I'll talk specifically about the United States. Consumers nowadays wanna have a voice. Consumers want to do business with companies who look like them. Who [00:31:00] understand their demographics in their communities. And I think that will continue to be an important part of the way that we see business happen here in the United States. 

I would say that smart business owner, every CEO needs to be thinking about risk and there is risk associated with openly saying, we've got a DEI program that we are focused on right now. So, you evaluate that business risk. You do what's necessary in order to still achieve what your stakeholders are paying you or what your stakeholders are expecting, right? 

How are you delivering value to your stakeholders? And if that means that I need to have a diverse set of suppliers in order to do that, then I need to have a diverse set of suppliers in order to do that.  

Vickie: Thank you so much Angela. And to your point regarding data, it is such a powerful tool when it comes to showing the value of inclusion both in the workforce and across the supply chain. 

And I'm optimistic about the organizations that really understand the why behind this work. The ones whose core values truly embrace inclusion [00:32:00] and who recognize that the future demands businesses expand their way of. Thinking to include perspectives from all backgrounds, because that's really what inclusion is all about. 

I believe those companies will keep leaning in, not just because it impacts the bottom line and not just because it's the right thing to do, but because it matters to their customers, their clients, their employees, their suppliers, and the communities they serve. Thank you for sharing that because to your point, one voice on its own may not seem powerful, but when we come together, our United Voice speaks volumes. 

Angela: There's some corporations here in the United States that have been around a long time and part of their success is built into the core of who they are. I don't know that there are many corporations that wanna change who your core values within a company are such an important part of your success. I'm not certain that there are companies that just wanna say we're just done with the core of who we [00:33:00] are, unless they aren't making the kind of money that they wanna make or achieving the kind of things that they wanna achieve. 

But that's another thing to keep in mind is that while we may, you know, see publicly, this discussion that we're doing away with these things. I do believe that deep down in the core, there are some business owners that started and they, you know, this is who we are and this is who we're going to be. And while I may call it something else, it's still the core of who I am. 

When I started my company, honesty and integrity just were just the core part of who we are. During the pandemic, I added another core value, but that is the core of who we are. And so what that means for a person who wants to work with us, a client of ours, a partner of ours, if we can't trust one another, we're not doing business. 

And I don't know that that core part of who we are is going to go away. And so I do believe that for corporations that have a history of having been around and doing good, right, because doing good, is good for business. I think that we'll continue to see support. It may look differently than the way that we've seen [00:34:00] in the past. 

I encourage business owners, at a conference that I spoke at last year and really think about that, right? One of the challenges is that we've stood up these silos, a silo that's specifically focused on diversity, a silo that's specifically focused on supply chain. Why isn't this a part of the core? If this were anything else that you were building into your corporation, you wouldn't have put it in a silo. 

So don't put those things in a silo either. Make them a part of who you are as an organization, and then it just becomes a part of the way that you do business on a regular basis.  

Vickie: Really good points. All right, so we're coming towards the, the close of this particular episode, but I want to allow you the opportunity to speak to your company. 

Tell us about X Nihilo Management, LLC. What does your company do? You are a computer science major. I know it's all about cybersecurity and protecting companies, preventing data breaches and ransom attacks, all of that interesting stuff. [00:35:00] Tell us about your company, how long has it been around, and anything else you would like to share? 

I also would like to know, because spoke to you going to Capitol Hill and actually speaking on behalf of cybersecurity, how your hat as a business owner with your company overlaps, or how do your responsibilities kind of connect to what you do with WIPP? 

Angela: That's a great question. So at its core, X Nihilo is really about solutions that drive business results. 

You mentioned that I have a technology hat. When I started working in information technology, one of my personal pet peeves is rework. So, I'm a software engineer. You build something, we would deliver it to the customer and the customer would say, yeah, that's not what I was looking for. And my little young 20 something year old brain I that just did not work. 

I didn't understand why we spent all that time doing that, and then the customer would say that it wasn't what they wanted. It took a few years out of college and working in the industry for me to realize that we [00:36:00] were selling solutions that weren't necessarily what a customer wanted. So, I started the business for two reasons. 

One, because there was a pay gap, a gender pay gap. I was never compensated at the same level that my male counterparts were.  

The second though, was that I felt like we had built a pair of scissors. We would hand a customer a pair of scissors. We didn't tell them the scissors are supposed to be meant to cut paper, and so a customer would take the scissors and they try to screw a nail into the wall, or they try and hammer something into the table, not understanding that those were scissors.  

In my mind, I said, we need to build solutions that are based on what a customer wants. If they're trying to cut a piece of paper, I'm going to give them scissors. If they're trying to hammer something, I'm going to give them a hammer. That was the initial thought process behind why I started X Nihilo because I really wanted to be able to drive business results. 

It's a lot of work. Well, it's easier nowadays, but it was a lot of work back then to build information [00:37:00] systems only for a customer. One system we built, it took us a year. I was blown away that in five days they were saying That's not what we asked for. My brain could not comprehend that. So, we moved away from simply selling solutions. 

And the core of everything that we do is to assess where you are, help you to build a plan, and then execute that plan. So from a cybersecurity standpoint, everybody and their mother selling cybersecurity technology and everybody and their mother's selling cybersecurity solutions. We work with the C-Suite. 

I don't wanna talk to your IT director. I don't wanna talk to your CISO. I don't wanna talk to your technical people. I wanna talk to business owners about risk. If you are in business today, and you don't have a cybersecurity strategy, I'm not talking about technology. If you don't have a cybersecurity strategy, you're putting your business at risk. 

That's the conversation that we're having with people that are in the C-suite to say, you're gonna have to pay for it anyway. You can pay for it now or pay for it later. You can pay for it now because you're being proactive about how you wanna handle cybersecurity. Or you can pay for it later when you have a breach. 

How's [00:38:00] about you pay for it now? And you do that in a way that allows you to leverage that technology investment that you're making in cybersecurity. What does your business strategy look like long term, and how can you use technology in order to assist you in that? That's the core of what we do from a cybersecurity standpoint. 

A lot of our customers are either working in the federal marketplace or wanna do business with the federal marketplace. And of course, that's highly regulated. So, we do have some services, cyber readiness as a service that will help a company understand how you do cyber the way the federal government wants, 'cause it's not the same way that you used to do cyber in the private sector. So we do some assessments, build out plans and help people to strategize, we're buying this new piece of equipment, or I'm moving into this new location, or we wanna let all of our employees work from home. All of those things have cybersecurity implications and we help them work through that. 

Now, so the intersection between, I told you one piece. The other piece is, is we are, I am a certified management consultant, so I stood up a, we've done all form of management [00:39:00] consulting most often that looks like strategy building. Traditional mission, vision, objectives, and execution. In 2018, I published Discovering Your Girl Powers. 

For years, people had been asking me to mentor them. I used to do that in my spare time and free. I got a little bit smarter and decided that maybe I should formulate that. So I did start a mastermind group where I work with individuals and business owners to help them to achieve their goals. So we use a combination of automated software tools and assessments, personality assessment, leadership assessments, to help them to get a good understanding of who they are as leaders. 

And that's important for us to be able to work with them, to help them make decisions as well as assessing where the business is. We put together a strategy in writing. We define some key performance indicators, and then we hold folks accountable. My sister calls me a beautiful bully, and I think I'll take that. 

So the hats that I wear, you know, our listeners probably don't, and I'm not [00:40:00] so certain not go down that path. But my path to leadership in WIPP in my current capacity was an unconventional one. And I served in a temporary capacity for about six months. And when the board of directors extended an offer for me to take on the role permanently, then I had to make adjustments in my business. 

And the fact that I am a WeBank certified business and have been involved with WIPP for so long, really made it easy for me to make that transition because I had received the education that I needed to understand what role I needed to bring into the organization. So I did bring in a Chief Operating Officer and she's up to speed and I'm so happy that I have her because she is running day-to-day point on X Nihilo while I am doing the great work that I'm doing at WIPP. 

So customers get to contact her and work with her to get, you know, they absolutely need to be on my calendar. Then she'll coordinate that. But that's the balancing act that's happening right now.  

Vickie: [00:41:00] Love it. And the website for your company, please share. 

Angela: It's www.xnihilo-mgmt.com. 

Vickie: Excellent. Thank you for sharing that. You mentioned you have a granddaughter, a2-year-old granddaughter. What would you say to her, thinking 15 years from now and the role that you will play starting now and you know, setting examples for her as a future, maybe entrepreneur, maybe an artist, who knows. 

But business sense is necessary regardless of what path you choose for yourself. What would you say to her and her generation based on your experiences and your success as a business owner, your current role with WIPP? 

Like what advice do you have for her in her generation?  

Angela: Yeah, I'd say one of my dear friends used [00:42:00] to say, unapologetically me, right? I think that women have to learn that people wanna see our authentic selves, but that's what they wanna see, right? So there are a few things that I would tell her. 

I think the first is I love Think and Grow Rich. It's one of my favorite books. Napoleon Hill, I think he was ahead of his time when he, when he wrote that, as well as some of the other things that he wrote. And one of the things that he says that is always in the back of my mind is that you're the master of your destiny, right? 

My children, they are sick of me because I always say to them, people will only do to you what you allow them to. You get to determine how you interact and engage with other people. So barriers are really important, but this concept that you're the master of your own identity means if you can think about it, you can believe it, and then you have to back that up with just fearlessness. 

The thing I love about young people, about children, I watched her learn how to crawl. I exercise, right? Every morning she was doing like [00:43:00] straight pull-ups on her little, um, bassinet and mountain climbers with her little legs. Like every single day she got up and she was going for it until she learned how to crawl. We forget that as adults, we forget that it's hard work. 

She'd fall over she'd bump her little head and she'd cry for a second and get right back up. That has to be a part of who we are as adults, right? Never be afraid to try again. Even if you fail, you will have learned a valuable lesson, right? What did I learn about the way that I hit my head this time that I don't wanna hit my head that next time? What was good about what just happened, right? 

Life is an adventure. If I keep trying, even if I fail, I'm gonna have an adventure and I'll learn a whole lot of things about myself. I think that each of us are born for such a time as this, right? Each of us are here for some reason, and I would hope that my granddaughter is able to understand that. My granddaughter and any other young person today and business owners, right? 

There's only one you and you have a mission to fulfill while you're here. It's [00:44:00] been my mission for some years. I'm trying to build this legacy of wisdom and wellness and wealth, and I hope that I'm able to pass them along and if I'm able to pass them along there, that will encourage someone else to do the same thing. 

Vickie: I love it. So there's a quote. It's never too late to be what you were meant to be. Are you familiar with that quote?  

Angela: No, I'm not, but I like it.  

Vickie: It's such a good one and it's so, so relevant today because there was a time in which, you know, we thought that, you know, I'm gonna go to school and then I'm going to go to college and then I'm going to do this for the rest of my life. 

That is no longer applicable. The thing about life, the fun thing about it, if you, if you lean into it, is that for as long as you live and breathe, you have the opportunity to, to live a lot of different dreams, to experiment with your dreams. And if you fail, don't give up on it. But if you tried a couple of times and that doesn't work out, move on to your next dream. 

It's never [00:45:00] too late to be who you were meant to be. And so I love that and I definitely want that so much for your granddaughter. 

Okay. Good stuff. All wonderful stuff. All right, so we cannot end this episode without taking a moment to pay tribute to the late Candace Waterman, who was the previous president and CEO of WIPP, who made her transition last year. 

So we definitely want to be able to share with all of our listeners that Angela stands on the shoulders of someone who did some wonderful, wonderful, great, great things, made a wonderful impact on WIPP. So I definitely wanted to acknowledge that, and I would love for you to speak, Angela, to maybe one or two initiatives that you're just so proud of that WIPP has accomplished within the past maybe two years when Candace was in the role, now that you're in the role, like. Share with us. Brag. Brag for a moment about WIPP. 

Angela: I'm much better today than I was this [00:46:00] time a year ago at even the mention of my dear friend Candace's name, right? So I can talk about her now without breaking up the way that I did in the past. Not only was she our president and CEO, I was the board chair for five years. 

We served alongside one another and we jokingly called each other, our partners in success, and it was truly a partnership that was built on success. My ability to transition into this role as the CEO on such short notice and under the circumstances that I found myself is a testament to the relationship that we had with respect to the mission of WIPP and what it is that we wanted to achieve. And part of my heartbreak is that not only was she a friend, we weren't finished right. We just, we just weren't finished doing that together. So for anyone that knew her, you know, she just was a force to be reckoned with and we really miss her. 

And so I'll say that the first and most significant accomplishment was the fact that I'm saying and able to talk to you today without ugly crying, as I call it, in public. Without a [00:47:00] beat, WIPP was able to continue its mission. That is a testament to the work that she did and the relationships that she built and the cohesiveness which with we were able to work, right. 

So the board and Candace and the staff at WIPP were able to work so well together that we were able to transition over, keep communicating with our stakeholders and provide value to our members. And so, I'm really proud of that accomplishment because I can remember conversations with the staff, and one of the staff people said, I just knew like we were gonna close because I worked for another nonprofit before where the CEO died, and then it didn't exist anymore. 

So that would've been a tragedy. I'm so happy to say that that didn't happen, right? I just, I will toot my own horn and say I don't know that there was another person who could have stepped into that role. 'cause this is a big role to fill on top of already having a business. There are some great things that we've been able to do. 

I'll talk about them in light of our core principles, right? So when we think about advocacy, it [00:48:00] truly is the heart of what we do. Last year was the first time that we've been able to have an in-person legislative fly in since the onset of COVID. So we've had legislative discussions. They all have been virtual for the last four or five years, and so it was really great for our members to be able to come to Washington DC and get on the hill and walk the halls and just, it was just a really exciting time for that. 

We were able to invite our partners in so they could be with us and had a beautiful reception. I live in Washington DC. We unveiled our 2024 economic blueprint, so our blueprint had not been updated in a little bit, so I'm excited that we were able to get that message out. 

It gives us a great opportunity to reconnect with policy makers and reinforce our commitment to championing women-owned businesses. It also outlines those strategic policy parties that I talked about that help us to enhance economic opportunities for women entrepreneurs. And then last year I was able to launch our instant impact meetings. 

This is where our members around the country get to sit down in the room with their Congress [00:49:00] people and have conversations about things that are of importance to them. 

Vickie: So much good stuff, so much good work and more to come, more to come. So before we end today, anything else that you wanna share regarding WIPP or any call to action for our listeners as relates to how they can support the mission of Women Impacting Public Policy? 

Angela: I do, I have two things I wanna share. Partially answered your question about wearing both hats. I believe that the fact that I am a business owner gives me an additional set of insights that I might not have, simply being the president and CEO. For the things that I'm talking to our members about, I also experience those when a member says, you know, I can, or I can't do this. 

That very thing may impact my business as well. So I believe that it gives me the ability to speak firsthand to some of the challenges, right. I understand how it is not easy. If it were that easy, being a business owner, everyone would be one. I think it gives me the ability to relate to them [00:50:00] in a way that others might not be able to do just leading a nonprofit advocacy organization. 

In terms of WIPP, I mean, I'll say it again. Get in the public policy or get out of business. Add your voice to ours. We need to be representing, we need your voice in order for us to really be heard on Capitol Hill this year. One of the other things that we did was we partnered with our friends over at WeBank and we offer an affiliate membership. 

So if you are a women business enterprise, so it's certified WBE with WeBank, you can join WIPP, we've got a discounted membership that you can take advantage of. So that’s one incentive for you. And then our advocacy conversations are happening all the time. You know, this is a great opportunity for you to join us. 

Take a look at our website and see what events are free and open to the public and just come join us.  

Vickie: I love it. Angela, thank you so much for taking time to join us today. There is so much that I learned, number one, and I'm optimistic that our listeners have some great [00:51:00] takeaways as well. We definitely appreciate you. 

JURISolutions Legal, most specifically, our fearless leader, Cindy, is such an advocate for you, for what you do, for Women Impacting Public Policy. We just thank you for allowing us this opportunity to learn from you today.  

Angela: Thank you so much for having me. Thanks for the work that you're doing and the support from JURISolutions for all that we're doing over at WIPP. 

Vickie: Absolutely. And thank you listeners for tuning into another episode of Not Your Average DEI Podcast. Until next time.